Math sucks, and computers are way too hard to learn about.
All I know is algebra, but I don't know anything about math that makes me feel like sitting and studying it for hours. It's terrible. I've been learning about computers for many years, and I can't do anything with one. Math and computers are wasting my time. It's lead and is leading nowhere for me. What's the point. When I first started learning about computers I figured I'd master them and have a lot of fun in the process. I'm extremely disappointed. And even algebra is too much math. Ugh. :cry: :sad: My faces aren't working when I click on them, and I don't remember what the crying one is. :evil:
BuddyCianci wrote: All I know is algebra, but I don't know anything about math that makes me feel like sitting and studying it for hours. It's terrible.
What are you needing to do? I mean math-wise, with computers? I'm really not the best at math, at least not compared to some, and for the most part (using C as an example) an attentive mind is far more crucial than lofty math skills.
I've been learning about computers for many years, and I can't do anything with one. Math and computers are wasting my time. It's lead and is leading nowhere for me. What's the point.
When I first got into computer science when I was in school, I was naive in thinking that learning about computers was sufficient for doing anything with them. That's not my viewpoint anymore. Rather, I learned my personal likes, dislikes, and focused upon them. Find what interests you the most and focus on that.
When I first started learning about computers I figured I'd master them and have a lot of fun in the process. I'm extremely disappointed. And even algebra is too much math. Ugh. :cry: :sad: My faces aren't working when I click on them, and I don't remember what the crying one is. :evil:
If you're frustrated with it you might need to take a step back and remind yourself what interests you in the field. It used to be that IT came with the promise of big bucks and a fancy car…that is definitely not the case anymore, because after the late 90's with the .com bubble everyone wanted a piece of the action. I wouldn't even dream of trying for a job fixing computers (hardware) anymore; the job market is inundated with people trained in that area.
Bottom line, don't be frustrated that you don't know everything or you can't do everything with computers. Even expertise in a specific programming language can take years, so find your passion in info tech and go from there.
stealth- wrote: BuddyCianci, you know this is the internet, right?
Nobody would care much in real life, except for close friends/family maybe, but considering this is the internet and that none of us really know you, let me be the first to say:
Nobody gives a fuck.
lol, I was waiting on someone to say that; surprised it wasn't said sooner.
Algebra?That is one of the widest ranging topics in Maths,you start at 2nd or 4th grade and can continue till a PhD,I really dont think anyone can truly say they know algebra or computers.You can only say that you are learning.
As a side note: What happened to HBH recently?Loads of newbie whiners.When I first saw the topic in the home page I thought it was that prdeltoid dude.:)
I mean I know Algebra I and II and nothing beyond that. I sort of dropped out of school. I graduated high school by taking the proficiency test. :evil: I'm not ignorant about most things, but math is a real weak point for me and it was in school also. On tests, I was real high in almost everything but math. In junior high tests, they had me at a top percent level for my CATBAC or whatever they're called tests for California. CATB? CBAT? I don't remember. Except math. I was one or two grades ahead of my grade or whatever, but it was still a real weak point for me. Their tests and everything called me smart, but I don't feel smart because it takes me forever to learn things, sort of. How many years has it taken everyone here to get to where they are as far as their proficiency with computers? I've been learning about them for years and they're still sort of a black box for me. I don't dislike math or computers as far as knowing about them, but learning about them is a pain in the ass and as far as math goes too time-consuming and annoying. I've learned Algebra I and II and very little about geometry. Tiny little bit about sets. Whatever. Some-high-school-level-math. I enrolled in a college years ago, for software development. I didn't realize how over my head it was until I was enrolled and there were optional calculus questions and weird things I know nothing about so I dropped out first semester. :evil: Since then I've learned a massive amount about computers, but not math. EDIT: CAT tests. California achievement tests. They told me I was in a top percent of them. For my school? I don't know. I don't know exactly how they work. But basically they told me I was way ahead of my grade and everything but I stopped going to school before I really started high school and then took the high school proficiency test to graduate. Then I self-taught everything I know. But learning, not knowing, is a pain in the ass. I like computers and don't mind math too much but when it takes a long time to learn about things (to do with math) it annoys me and I stop feeling like reading about it very quickly. I also don't like physical activity so I flunked P.E. in I think it was 6th grade and didn't have any plans on trying.
BuddyCianci wrote: Then don't read it and go find something else to do. Quit moaning.
MoshBat is a curious creature, and noone can say for sure what makes him tick.
Regardless, on this issue, I think he's mostly right. If you're just going to make a thread to illicit sympathy, people aren't going to go for it. Plus, you're coming across with more than a smidgen of entitlement. Anything that anyone has done with a computer, or with math, has been done as a result of hard work and study. There's not some sort of deus ex machina explanation for why some people can code.
You'll see above I gave what I think were some helpful suggestions. Likely that's going to be the best you'll get from this thread.
I guess I'll answer somewhat seriously here 'cause it's been far too long. Until recently, I've felt relatively the same about maths. I hate algebra, I despise geometry, and I almost committed suicide every day I had to walk into my pre-calc class. Sure I got B's in everything, but it was pure torture and hated every second of it. Then this year I took a calculus class and stuff kind of changed. I loved it and am actually considering becoming a teacher and dicking around with it for the rest of my life.
Moral of the story is that math is a giant subject. It covers anything from counting to determining when a blob that increases in size at a rate proportional to it's size every time it absorbs another object will grow larger than the Sears Tower, therefore becoming a traffic hazard and somewhat of a worry (this was actually a problem in my book, by the way). Just because you hate algebra doesn't mean you won't be able to stomach anything else and just because you're not good at something now doesn't mean you'll never be able to pick it up. If you still feel that burning desire to stick with computers and math despite their current shortcomings, then go crazy. But if you don't, then you could always just quit and move on to something that doesn't make you spontaneously tell a bunch of random kids over the internet that you're dissatisfied with your life.
The choice is yours.
I don't dislike math exactly, I dislike learning about it. I don't mind knowing what I know about it. I like it, really. But when I'm learning about it I feel like doing something else constantly. I have a book on geometry, a book on trigonometry and a book on pebble. Maybe they would make me a lot more interested as I advanced through them. Futility, why do you like pebble?
BuddyCianci wrote: Futility, why do you like pebble? I like pebble because it gets stuck in my shoe and pisses me off for the rest of the day? Or do you mean the obscure JAVA blogging software that I have absolutely no ties to? Either way- huh?
And of course you're going to have a hard time concentrating on your math book when there's other things to be done. I love computers, but you don't see me whining when I find it difficult to sift through a manual. That's the way things are, and you've got to decide if they're worth it or not.
Futility, why did you decide you like math when you learned calculus? I don't know calculus, but I've glanced at it some. I'm wondering why suddenly it would make you appreciate math more. freekstyle: I want to learn a lot about computers. I know quite a bit. If I can feel content with what I know without learning more math, I'll do it though. If I live to be 40, and I've been learning about computers the whole time, I'll definitely be content. I might be content in 5 years if I study all the time like I do now. Not knowing a lot about computers bothers me and makes me learn more. Sorry if I'm rambling, I'm sleepy. I started this thread as a general conversation thread and to see what everyone has to say, mainly.
I think it all has to do with the mentality. If you wake up one day with all memories of the past erased, and if you start afresh, I don't think that you will have the same amount of dislike for Maths and Computers as you have now. And I think that's what people have been saying all along the thread. Other than that, if you don't understand what I just said and people have been saying all along, nobody gives a fuck. That's the maximum help we can provide.
fashizzlepop wrote: What about computers are you really interested in learning. If it has anything to do with programming you are screwed. ? I know a lot about programming. I've experimented with a lot of languages. I've read a book and used the example code at least, for Perl, Python, x86 assembly, a little HTML/PHP, C/C++… I'm real focused on Python right now. I'm going to learn Python/C. I've learned a lot about C, and I own "C in a Nutshell." I'm going to get very comfortable with Python though before I go back to C. I understand, goluhaque. I mainly started this thread as a conversation thread and to say I feel disheartened about the amount of things I can do with a computer after studying for as long as I have.
One of the most important advantages that studying math provides is the mindset; the mental discipline to precisely define a problem and to rigorously create a solution. As for specific knowledge, everything under discrete mathematics is quite useful. For example, if you understand FSAs, regular expressions are trivial. Similarly, understanding lambda calculus (ftp://ftp.cs.ru.nl/pub/CompMath.Found/lambda.pdf) makes any language in the Lisp family quite tractable. As another example, many algorithms are founded in graph theory. Fortunately, many discrete topics aren't too complex. You'll just have to find an approach that works for you. Try playing with math, rather than learning it. Project Euler might help with that. Also get yourself some books by Martin Gardner and Douglas Hofstadter.
As for the interesting or weird stuff, much of it you don't get to until after calc, though some of it you can understand early on. Surreal numbers, the Cayley-Dickson construction (which gives complex numbers and quaternions, useful for representing rotation in 3-D graphics), transfinite numbers (including Cantor's transfinite cardinals), Gödel's incompleteness theorems (which are related to the halting problem)… From Topology, we get interesting surfaces such as Möbius bands and Klein bottles(http://www.geom.uiuc.edu/~banchoff/Klein4D/Klein4D.html), plus one of my favorite jokes: what's the definition of a topologist? Someone who can't tell a cup of coffee from a doughnut.
@OP:
From http://catb.org/esr/faqs/hacker-howto.html
Q: Do I need to be good at math to become a hacker?
A: No. Hacking uses very little formal mathematics or arithmetic. In particular, you won't usually need trigonometry, calculus or analysis (there are exceptions to this in a handful of specific application areas like 3-D computer graphics). Knowing some formal logic and Boolean algebra is good. Some grounding in finite mathematics (including finite-set theory, combinatorics, and graph theory) can be helpful.
Hope that helps. Just take a break. Math is easy, don't over-complicate things, think of steps to solve a problem. Execute these steps. Easy, isn't it?
Start with counting the change you get from the cashier :P